Husband was on SOR but isn't anymore - now pregnant

[Anon987654321]

I'll try and keep this as brief as possible, my husband was convicted of 14 counts of indecent images about 7 years ago. He was around 23 when convicted and offences occurred when he was in his late teens. All images were lowest category. I was with him at the time he was convicted and we married a year later. He was given a SOPO for 10 years.

The police always said he was lowest risk, they came out once a year to see us, he had to sign SOR and abide by the SOPO.

We started to think about having a baby after 5 years. We spoke to his police officer who said that we should let them know if I get pregnant so that they can do what they need to do, but if we work with them there should be no concerns. He said there was a possibility social services would want "no unsupervised contact" which would be hard for me but not impossible. He said they don't just take babies away from parents for no reason, so to ignore stories in the press of babies being removed from hospital etc and reiterated that as long as we worked with them he could see no issues.

Fast forward a year to the next meeting and we still hadn't tried for a baby. We had just decided not to. We spoke to the police officer again and said we were worried about social services involvement. He explained they (the police) would refer to social services as part of his being on the SOR. So we said we were worried and we're happy to wait another 3.5 years until he came off the SOR/SOPO. There were 2 police officers there that time and they had a discussion between themselves looking at the paperwork and said that they thought we could appeal the length of the SOPO as it should have been 5 years not 10 and if it was cancelled he would also automatically come off the SOR. We asked what would happen if we had a baby after coming off the SOR and he said the police would have no reason to refer the pregnancy to social services. He said the health visitor when she came out may have a flag on her records somehow so might refer but he wasn't sure?

We applied and the SOPO was cancelled in late 2014/early 2015. We have been on holiday since with no questions at border security so presumably he is no longer appearing on the SOR.

I'm now 37 weeks pregnant. And starting to panic. I've researched loads and can see that social services could still want to carry out a risk assessment. I understand why, I'm just terrified of it happening. I can't find any stories of people who have come off SOR then had a baby, everything I can find is related to people still on SOR which isn't relevant to us.

I guess my question is, how would social services know about us?

Is there any way they could just take my baby from us at hospital without any prior contact?

We have had no social services involvement at all. Midwife asked at booking in if we had ever had social services involvement in anyone in our household (standard question I believe) and I answered (honestly) that no we hadn't.

Health visitor is coming out next week and I'm scared of what she will know or ask?

I don't want to go to social services and ask them as I think highlighting our case to them would just open up an investigation but I am stressing so much over this.

[Suzie, FRG Adviser]

Dear Anon987654321

Welcome to the Parents’ Discussion Forum.

My name is Suzie an Adviser at Family Rights Group.

I am sorry that you are having such a worrying time at this stage of your pregnancy when you want to be looking forward to the birth of your baby.
You want to know how Children Services (new name for social services) will know about you and your husband expecting a baby. As you have said in your post, you were told the Health Visitor may be aware because of a flag being in existence. This is possible as your husband was a registered sex offender. Have you given your husband’s name?

As your husband, I assume, is no longer required to engage with probation or the police a referral to Children Services might not have been made as would be required where there is police or probation involvement. If no referral is made to Children Services by any professional or other person then they will not be aware of your husband’s conviction.

I am concerned however, that you are very anxious about the situation you find yourself in at the moment and it may be that you and your husband have to have a frank discussion about what you wish to do. It seems to be that this anxiety that you have at the moment will be with you as a worry of what might happen if your husband’s conviction comes to light.

If your decision is to speak to the Health Visitor about it, she is likely to speak to Children Services about it. What action Children Services take, will depend on the level of concern that have after meeting with you and your husband. It is likely that an initial assessment would be carried out and if there are no concerns, no further action taken. However, the decision might be to carry out a risk assessment to find out what level of risk, if any, your husband poses to the child.

Alternatively, if you both decide that you do not wish to disclose his conviction at this stage, then I would suggest that you ensure that you have details of who advised you when you ask whether it was necessary for a referral to be made to Children Services. You have said you were told by the police, so get them to put it in writing or at the very least get the names and title. This might prove useful if in the future Children Services become involved.

I am not able to advise you to say nothing but think it is important for you and your husband to make an informed decision about how to proceed. A copy of our advice sheet about Children Services involvement is here for your information.

I think it would be very useful if you contact the Lucy Faithfull Foundation on 0808 1000 900. They deal specifically with issues relating of sex offences and will most likely be able to give clear guideline about your current situation.

Your situation has raised some interesting questions which I will look into further and if there is more in depth information that I can provide you with I will post further on your thread shortly.

You may if you wish telephone our free confidential advice line on 0808 801 0366 to speak to an Adviser. The advice line is open from 9.30 a.m. to 3.00 p.m. Monday to Friday.

I hope you will find this helpful.

Best wishes

Suzie.

[Anon987654321]

Hi suzie thank you so much for your reply.

Yes I have given my husbands name to midwife/hospital etc. I have purposely not hidden or concealed any information from anyone and went to booking in with midwife at 8 weeks (didn't try and "hide" the pregnancy), as concealment of any information just makes us look like we have something to hide and I know this would look bad in the eyes of children's services should they ever get involved.

I guess I will see what the health visitor knows/says next week and go from there.

I'm not happy to volunteer information to children's services, from what I have read on here and other forums it doesn't tend to go well. And as there is no legal reason for us to disclose my pregnancy to children's services I think it is best to stay quiet.

I guess I can't get my head around how the system does or should work. Is there a gap in the system where a woman could meet a man who used to be on SOR, he not tell her of his past and they go on to get married, have children etc with her none the wiser, unless someone referred to children's services for something else, or raised a case under the new Sarah's law disclosure thing? Is that why the new Sarah's law was needed, so that you can check the history of a man you are involved with?

It's not relevant in my case as I do know all the facts but it certainly makes you think.

I think you have set my mind at ease in a way, as my husband has no contact with police/probation there is no one to make a referral, so providing all goes well with the health visitor I will be much happier. I guess it will always be an issue that might come up at some point in the future but me and my husband will face that together as and when it happens.

I was more concerned that children's services could just turn up at hospital with a court order to remove baby but I can see that I was being irrational, for that to happen someone would have to make the referral and in our case there isn't anyone to make such a referral. Even if someone did refer us, children's services would contact us first and not just turn up with a court order.

Thank you for your help it is much appreciated.

[Murray72]

Dear Anon,

Have you ever done any work with a professional regarding your husband conviction and sopo? I ask this because as the non offending parent CS, should they become involved will expect you to be able to protect your child from any risk of future harm. If and when CS become involved you need to be prepared to attend such courses raising awareness of sexual offending behaviour. I personally think you should have informed your midwife at your booking in appointment and that way any pre-birth assessments would have been carried out and minimised any anxiety that you may be feeling now your in the late stages of your pregnancy. Also without raising any alarm you and your husband know the responsibility placed upon you to inform the correct agencies regarding the sopo. As you mentioned the sopo is no longer in place but CS will want to assess your partner to ensure he no longer poses a risk to children.

Without causing any alarm I would avoid any behaviour that could be seen as been dishonest or not accepting of your situation, if CS think you do. It accept the risk posed this could be used against you, and if they believe you have misled them this also will be a black mark.


Good luck with your impending birth and keep us posted.

[Anon987654321]

I have never done any courses myself but would do whatever children's services asked of me should it come to that.

We have always cooperated with the authorities, so far only the police/probation, but as I said in my first post the police officer was supportive of us starting a family and also supported our application to remove my husband from the SOR. In fact he suggested it.

I know what you are saying, I'm very much an honest person and normally would always say be up front and honest with everyone, but in this case I just feel that going to children's services and saying hello come and investigate us would just cause us unnecessary stress. If they contact us, we will of course co-operate every step of the way but I genuinely don't think we are under an obligation to inform children's services that we are having a baby.

I'd be interested to hear from others in the same situation as we are, where the offender has been removed from the register, but I just can't find any information at all. I'm hoping this is because people in our situation don't tend to have any problems with children's services. As I said in my 2nd post, what would happen if a woman met an ex-offender, and didn't know his past? What if they had a baby, would anyone tell her about his past?

[Murray72]

I would try and get some advice regarding the consequences from one of the agencies that support and run sex offender courses, Lucy Faithful and in the North East the Mosaic Project, Barnados. But whilst the Police were supportive I think CS will look at it from a different angle, they have to assess the safety of the child.

i understand your comments regarding CS removing babies but my child was removed from my care because my ex husband downloaded illegal images of children, it took 4+ years to get that child back in my care with no CS involvement. It is not an easy road to choose. I divorced my ex husband in 2009.

[Anon987654321]

Thank you for your advise Murrey.

I just spoke to an advisor at Lucy Faithfull Foundation. She spoke to a police officer and social worker at the Foundation as she wasn't sure about our situation, she said it is very unusual. The police and social worker both advised that it is at our discretion whether we inform Children's Services or not. We can self refer if we want to. If we do, they will come out and do a risk assessment and may impose a no unsupervised contact order which would obviously be very hard. However, they said that we are not under any obligation to inform children's services. It is our choice. If my husband was to reoffend, it may not look good that I did not proactively contact them, and they would assess my ability to safeguard the child. I'm willing to take that risk.

The advisor said to go with my gut instinct and listen to my gut at all times as the baby grows up. I can contact children's services at a later date if I want to.

I feel very relieved that I have spoken to them, and had it confirmed that we are under no obligation to inform children's services ourselves.

[Maddog77]

Hi there I just happened to read your story. I notice u ask about a gap in the system ! As in no longer on S O.R getting married having kids , failing to disclose etc. Well that is exactly what happened to me !! I was married for 5 year , we already had a son together and at this point I was pregnant with our second child. Health visitor put a referral in for help with our son who was not sleeping at the time and had been showing strange behaviour. ( Turned out he was autistic) . Background checks were done and my husband's name was red flagged. It took social services over 2 monthes to confront my husband and tell him he had to disclose to me. I can't even begin to tell u the pain and hurt I felt. My whole world literally fell apart around me . I had absolutely no idea of my husband's past. As for input with social services ? I don't really no what to say to be honest . Iv been made to feel like I'm the one that's commited the crime not him. 2 years down the line and he is taking me to court for unsupervised access to his children. He believes he will get this as his crime was 30 year ago. It's just all to much tbh

[Suzie, FRG Adviser]

Dear Maddog77

Thank you for your post. I am sorry to hear about all the difficulties you and your family have experienced.

I have posted a response and links to organisations that may be helpful to you, on your other post.

With best wishes

Suzie