Can my 16 year old refuse to participate in Child in Need plan?

[Boobop16]

My core question is in the topic title but I need to explain a bit of background.

Child is 16 able, popular generally happy. Her dad died a few years ago and I have now been made redundant. All was well until Christmas and my daughter even said it was the best Christmas since dad died. During January her behaviour changed dramatically. Rude aggressive, telling me I should have died instead of her dad etc. then on 1st Feb she turned up at home 4 hours late, we had an argument, she punched me in the face and I slapped her arm. We both retreated for a bit then talked it through and all was well....half term came along and she went to a town 30 miles away to the cinema with friends. I don't drive so we thoroughly checked the Sunday train times for getting back etc. by 10.30 I was getting worried normally she keeps in constant touch. Eventually I got through on the phone and she told me there were no trains, I offered to send a friend to get her, to get her a taxi, to arrange for her to stay at a local friends and even for me to get a taxi there and bring her back by taxi. I got told none of these were acceptable. I tried to call her again and her phone went to voicemail. In the end I messaged her on Facebook asking where she was. She told me she was staying at a friends (one I know well). So I sent her a mess age saying ok but she was grounded for her unreasonable behaviour (it was 11.45 by this time).

She came home and accepted her grounding but I refused to let her have internet. Next thing I knew I was in the shower and heard a car screeching down the road. When I got out my daughter had gone. It turned out another of her friends parents had taken my daughter away without me knowing (she was still 15). Next thing I knew I was in a police cell arrested for common assault and malicious communication. Both were dropped eventually but I wasn't allowed to see my daughter for 3 months. An s47 was done and I have only just got the report. It says my daughter was placed on a child in need plan on 10th March, I even asked if this would be done on 2nd March and was told no. My daughter is back home and happy now, we've talked a lot and it seems it was all down to feelings about her dad. She has been passed from a sw to YSS (youth worker from CS) who says she has to continue seeing them even though she told them she didn't want to before I had had any contact. There has been no date set for review. The CS are deemed inadequate a and the YSS worker told me she was unlikely to be taken off the plan because they are due a re inspection. My daughter has begged me to support her in having nothing to do with them. What can she or I do? Please help!

[Ignatious]

Hi again Boobop16,

Glad to see my post helped you post yours.

Quick question regarding your situation. (but I'm Sure Suzie will get round to posting a reply).

You said you had a S47. Can I ask what the outcome was? Were things escalated to a child protection plan. (I only ask as I've been on a S47 which escalated to a CPP, then dropped down to a CIN plan). I'm presuming you had some sort of meeting whereby it was decided a CIN plan was the best way moving forward.

In an attempt to answer your question (but please bear in mind I'm not qualified in any areas and this is my own opinion), Your child is 16, if she does not want to participate, I think that's her decision and I don't think anybody can 'force' her to do so. As her legal guardian until she's 18, I think the CIN is primarily there for you/CS to meet and discuss how things are progressing. I think if you didn't want to go to these, these meetings would still go ahead in your absence (and without your input) and would potentially have a significantly negative outcome.

I would be very much interested in finding out if it is at all possible to come off a CIN plan myself, and I wish you and your daughter good luck moving forwards.

[Boobop16]

Thanks for a swift reply. No there was never a cpp. I asked on 2nd March if she would be put on cpp or cin and was told no. There was no meeting with me about the CIN and even though the s47 stating she was to be cin is dated 10th March I knew nothing about it until 2 weeks ago when the report arrived in the post. The report states that I have metal health issues (which I don't) and as she spent less than an hour with me in total I'd like to know how she made that judgement. There are some 20 factual errors in the report ranging from when my daughter started her school(out by four years) to which hand my daughter broke in an accident at school when I was 70 miles away, to my husband apparently leaving my daughter money, to my financial situation and my "inability to claim appropriate benefits". My daughter hates them, all they do is ask where she will be and when (she's been lucky to have been invited on two overseas holidays with friends this summer at no expense to us). I've seen the YSS worker twice since she took over on4th May. She turned up 2//12 hours late the first time and the second at 6pm unannounced for 15 minutes to quid my daughter about the holidays, talk about her fear of flying, and the difficulty of buying light bulbs.

[Ignatious]

I'm not totally against Social Services or by which name they go by, currently Children's Services, They have there uses, and bottom line, they are there to do a job. What I don't like about them is when they get it wrong, there does not seem much the people on the wrong end of CS can do. Moving on to what we can do,...

I would recommend getting as much information about your situation as possible. If your daughter was placed on a CIN plan, a S47 would have been conducted, pre a S47, there would have been a strategy discussion (which parents are not consulted on which is standard practice). But, as there is a record of this, and it pertains to both you and your daughter, you can put in a Subject Access Request for a copy of that Strategy discussion. I would recommend pointing out in any request that you are parent to daughter and as such are entitled to that information as a parent. If your daughter is able to, get her to write her own letter asking for that same information in her own right. I'm not sure where you would apply for this information, but your Local Authority should be able to help (as CS's are like a division of the LA). Try googling <your home town> Local Authority Information Governance.

You could also look at getting a copy of your police report, and your local police authority if you search online should have information on where you can apply for subject access requests.

Quick note on SAR's, They usually carry a £10 (max charge) admin fee, and it can take up to 40 days to receive a response.

With this information, you should be better informed on how you wish to proceed. If you feel you have a complaint to make, in the first instance you should direct your complaint to the organisation in question. i.e. Children's Services or as they come under your Local Authority, you could direct any complaints to them. Again, a google search should provide you with that information.

TP

[Boobop16]

Thanks Tp. I am in the slightly odd position that I used to work alongside the director of children's services. On one occasion when the social worker lied to me I told her I was calling him there and then and the issue was sorted in 15 minutes. No strategy meeting was held. As the police investigation was dropped I don't think that is an avenue. My adult son was sent a copy of his statement which also contained factual errors. I have in the past been involved in CIN reviews as a professional, but I can't quite see who they would invite to one for my daughter. She has just left school, but not yet started 6th form college, her only contact with the health profession has been dental and ophthalmic check ups, 2 broken fingers and one broken wrist (2 fingers at school and the wrist whilst performing in a sports event with over 800 spectators). The sw has been taken off the case so there is only really the YSS worker and her boss. Between them they have met my daughter 3 times. The CS specifically failed their last inspection for de escalating cases from cpp to cin and taking people off cin to soon. That meant the whole CS service was graded inadequate and the YSS worker even said so. I have read the report and can see why. I have spoken to Ofsted and asked that mine and my daughters views are consulted in the upcoming inspection. I'm still not sure how to proceed, my daughter was led to believe she would get counselling etc but has been offered nothing so we have arranged this through the college from September so there seems no point at all in their involvement.

[Suzie, FRG Adviser]

Dear Boobop16

Welcome to the Parents’ Discussion Forum.

My name is Suzie, online adviser at Family Rights Group.

I see from your post that you have a bit of a difficult time with your 16 year old daughter but things have now settled down.
It is concerning that you were not able to see your daughter for 3 months whilst she was being accommodated by children services. This may have been because of the police investigation and bail conditions or your daughter’s specific request. Children services have a duty to promote contact when a child is in their care.

In any event, things are now back on track and I am sure you are pleased to have your daughter back home.

If children services carried out s.47 child protection enquiries and decided on a child in need plan, this suggests that it was considered more appropriate to offer support to you and your daughter. You say your daughter was placed on a child in need plan (CIN). Did you not attend a CIN meeting with the social worker and other professionals? It would be usual to have a meeting not just tell you she was placed on a plan. You may wish to make a complaint about how the case was managed and our advice sheet relating to this is attached.

In response to your core question, your daughter is 16 and if she does not wish to be on a CIN plan or engage with it, then she should inform the social worker. Any arrangement for your daughter should be discussed with her and the best way forward would be for her to have someone who she is able to work with. Your daughter’s wishes and feeling are to be taken into account when making decisions about her since she is 16.
If she is not willing to engage then this should be communicated to children services, you need to make sure that they know your daughter does not wish to be involved. A CIN plan is voluntary and provided you are able to ensure that she is receiving adequate support without the plan, then this should be alright.

A copy of our advice sheet relating to family support is here for your information.

Should you wish to speak to an adviser, please telephone our confidential advice line on 0808 801 0366. The advice line is open Monday to Friday from 9.30 a.m. to 3.00 p.m

I hope you find this helpful.

Best wishes,

Suzie

[Boobop16]

Many thanks Suzie. My daughter wasn't accommodated under s20 but staying with her friend (the one whose mother abducted her from my house). This was specifically against mine and her elder brothers wishes (he is 25 and they are very close). I was on police bail for 6 weeks. My son saw my daughter twice whilst she was away. The family she was staying with was complex with the parents divorced and my daughter and her friend spending alternate nights at each of the parents houses. When my daughter was with the father she was lovely, when at the mother's she was vile rude and aggressive. My daughter was very heavily influenced by the mother who, just a week before all this happened told me I was "lucky my husband died as it was better than him leaving you". My daughter told me she would come home when her GCSE's finished, she came for a one night sleepover the day of her last exam and in the morning said she never wanted to go back to the friends house and could she stay, which is what she has done.

I wasn't told about the child in need plan at all let alone invited to a meeting. The plan and report are dated 10th march but the first I knew of the cin was one line near the end.

My daughter told them in may half term that she didn't want to see them. Then they turned up unannounced and told me and my daughter that she had to see them as she was on a cin. My daughter repeated in front of me that she didn't want to that is when the comment about inspection was made. I'm worried that if either of us refuse they will try to escalate to a cpp. It seems odd that I haven't heard anything from them for another 3 weeks. How often should review meetings be done? Especially as she has just returned home. Huge thanks.

[Suzie, FRG Adviser]

Hi Boobop16,

Sometimes children services will say that if a parent does not work to a child in need plan and access the support being offered that this will increase the risk to a child. Then it may be escalated to a child protection conference to see whether a child protection plan is needed.

You or your daughter could email the social worker and team manager and ask whether this could be an option.

Also remind them that your daughter has told them she does not want to be subject to a plan and that she is 16 so is old enough to make her own decisions.
If your daughter is concerned, she could seek legal advice about her options from the National Youth Advocacy Service (NYAS).

In respect of review dates for child in need plans, you should check your local authority children in need policy or threshold document that you should ne able to find on children services website. Decisions about this are now made at a local level.

I hope this helps but please post back if you have further questions.

Best wishes,

Suzie

[Boobop16]

Many thanks Suzie. Yes I understand the bit about if they think I am not complying, however, I did go to my gp and even went to counselling at CS insistence (although that ended up mostly working on what had changed in my daughter, and my son, counsellor all turned out to be right in the end that it was all about her dad). The plan pretty much says that I have mental health issues, am a suicide risk (which my dr, counsellor, and a psych nurse disagree with) because I said I couldn't live with her being accommodated in the local drug hostel and that I would walk over broken glass to find a better alternative. It then says the aim is to get her to come home or find her a homeless hostel or last resort s20 accommodation and that is it.

We no longer have any contact with. Sw, just the youth worker, I don't have any contact information for her. I know the building she officially works from as my offices used to be there, but she is never there.

The policy document just uses the standard level 1 to 4 swing diagram and gives no timescales or anything relevant to our circumstances. This has now been going on since 15th February and there has not been a single proper minuted meeting. Only meetings have been conducted in my home, initial CS visit 4 days after the event to ask me what happened and treat me like a turnip, 2nd march (my daughters birthday) an unannounced visit to question me on where my daughter could go to live, a youth worker visit on 17th May when I was told they wer going to meet my daughter to fill in a homelessness form (but then spent time quizzing me on my personal life, how often I go out, which is laughable since the answer was twice in the last 4 years, why my daughter had flown alone at 15, My personal finances, my daughters relationship with her brother and then with her brothers best friend (they tried to imply an inappropriate relationship, which is utter nonsense to the point where my daughter actually laughed at them and said that he was her "other brother". Then the next we saw or heard of them was30th June when the youth worker turned up at the house stayed for 15 minutes while my daughter again told her she didn't want anything to do with them and went off to pack for holiday. Not at Dickie bird since.

So, we have complied with everything on the cin plan, as they attribute the problem with my daughter to my daughters "lack of respect for discipline due to mothers behaviour" all the targets were for me. We have exceeded the targets. I think if necessary I will let my daughter refuse to engage, while I play ball with them for the sake of my daughter. The only one my daughter didn't think was an incompetent idiot was the YSS workers boss so maybe my daughter could write her a letter saying why she did not want to engage etc. I am told this woman will chair the review so if I hand it over then it will have to be documented in the minutes. Thank you to everyone who has helped it is so difficult not being able to fully help my beautiful girl at such a critical time.

[B457]

Can a 15 year old refuse an assessment