My 3 children were put in care when I was forced into signing a section 20 form with threats of going to court if I didn't sign it. The first review is coming up at the begining of may.i have been sent the details of the meeting but am not on the guest list, does anyone know weather I can attend and how do I get all the paperwork I need before the meeting. What is the chance of getting them back after the first meeting. Sorry I am new to this but are the children expected to come to the meeting I would be gratefully for any info
Thankyou they were taken because I have m.e but have had this for 13 years and managed so far as a single parent
3 children in care
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Suzie, FRG Adviser
- Posts: 4722
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:57 pm
Re: 3 children in care
Dear Hollna22
Welcome to the parents’ discussion board. Thank you for your post. My name is Suzie. I am Family Rights Group’s online adviser.
I am sorry to hear about the difficulties you and your family are currently experiencing. You explain that your three children were recently placed in foster care under a voluntary section 20 arrangement. You felt coerced into agreeing to this. You say that the children went into care because of you having ME, a condition you have had for 13 years. The children’s first Looked After Child review is due to take place very soon. You have several questions about the review itself, and you want to know if the children could be returned to your care after the first meeting.
I will try to answer all your questions. But first, I wanted to clarify with you that section 20 is voluntary. You should not have been coerced or made to feel forced into agreeing that the children be placed into foster care. However, if the social worker believed that it was no longer safe for the children to remain in your care, and you did not want to agree to section 20 then they may have made a court application for an emergency protection order or an interim care order. This is what they suggested to you. It would have been for the court to decide if the threshold was met and the children’s needs required them to make an order allowing the local authority to share parental responsibility with you, and to remove the children from you, if that was necessary. If children’s services apply for a court order for your children, then as a parent you would be entitled to legal aid for a solicitor to represent you in court.
You can still withdraw your consent to the section 20 voluntary arrangement at any time. You do not have to give notice. However, if children’s services were still concerned that this was not safe for the children they could apply to the court as above or ask the police to take them into police protection.
As you have a LAC review due in a few days, it may be a good idea to take part in that meeting and to put forward there that you would like the children returned home; you can find out more about whether children’s services would agree to this and if not, what work they want you to do to and in what timescale for the children to return to your care in a planned way. If they do not agree to this then they should be able to tell you why not. But if they suggested that the children should remain in foster care for a longer and you do not agree they would need the court to make an order.
As the children’s mother. you have parental responsibility for them, and you have agreed to them being accommodated in foster care, you should be present at the LAC review. You may be sent a consultation form to complete. The children would usually be present for some if not all the meeting, but this depends on their age, understanding and wishes. The Independent Reviewing Officer (IRO) must find out their views and include them in the meeting.
You should have a copy of all the LAC paperwork before the meeting. You can ask the social worker for the plans. If you have not received them then let the IRO know.
We have very detailed information about children in the care system under a voluntary arrangement here. This explains in much more detail about these processes, and your rights as a parent.
If you have family and friends who could support you to care for your children or care for them (as an alternative to unrelated foster care) then please let the social worker know as soon as possible. A family group conference (FGC) is a good way of bringing your network together so this is something you can ask the social worker to arrange if you think that it might help.
I am sorry to hear that you have ME. Parents are not usually asked to agree to their children going into foster care because a parent has a particular disability. As an adult with a disability, you may be entitled to some help for yourself from Adult Social Care so do look into this. However, if the parent’s health needs negatively affect their ability to care for the children safely and meet their needs then this could prompt children’s services to seek agreement to foster care. An FGC might also help identify what help your network can provide you to help you as a parent with a disability.
If you need some emotional support or practical advice, then the charities MATCH and Family Line may interest you.
If you would like to discuss your situation with an adviser, please call the freephone advice line on 0808 8010366, Mon to Fri, 9.30 am to 3.00 pm (except bank holidays. If you prefer you can post again with any further queries or send an advice enquiry form or use our webchat.
I hope that the children’s LAC review goes well, that you are clearer about your options and know how to progress the children’s return home, if possible.
Best wishes
Suzie
Welcome to the parents’ discussion board. Thank you for your post. My name is Suzie. I am Family Rights Group’s online adviser.
I am sorry to hear about the difficulties you and your family are currently experiencing. You explain that your three children were recently placed in foster care under a voluntary section 20 arrangement. You felt coerced into agreeing to this. You say that the children went into care because of you having ME, a condition you have had for 13 years. The children’s first Looked After Child review is due to take place very soon. You have several questions about the review itself, and you want to know if the children could be returned to your care after the first meeting.
I will try to answer all your questions. But first, I wanted to clarify with you that section 20 is voluntary. You should not have been coerced or made to feel forced into agreeing that the children be placed into foster care. However, if the social worker believed that it was no longer safe for the children to remain in your care, and you did not want to agree to section 20 then they may have made a court application for an emergency protection order or an interim care order. This is what they suggested to you. It would have been for the court to decide if the threshold was met and the children’s needs required them to make an order allowing the local authority to share parental responsibility with you, and to remove the children from you, if that was necessary. If children’s services apply for a court order for your children, then as a parent you would be entitled to legal aid for a solicitor to represent you in court.
You can still withdraw your consent to the section 20 voluntary arrangement at any time. You do not have to give notice. However, if children’s services were still concerned that this was not safe for the children they could apply to the court as above or ask the police to take them into police protection.
As you have a LAC review due in a few days, it may be a good idea to take part in that meeting and to put forward there that you would like the children returned home; you can find out more about whether children’s services would agree to this and if not, what work they want you to do to and in what timescale for the children to return to your care in a planned way. If they do not agree to this then they should be able to tell you why not. But if they suggested that the children should remain in foster care for a longer and you do not agree they would need the court to make an order.
As the children’s mother. you have parental responsibility for them, and you have agreed to them being accommodated in foster care, you should be present at the LAC review. You may be sent a consultation form to complete. The children would usually be present for some if not all the meeting, but this depends on their age, understanding and wishes. The Independent Reviewing Officer (IRO) must find out their views and include them in the meeting.
You should have a copy of all the LAC paperwork before the meeting. You can ask the social worker for the plans. If you have not received them then let the IRO know.
We have very detailed information about children in the care system under a voluntary arrangement here. This explains in much more detail about these processes, and your rights as a parent.
If you have family and friends who could support you to care for your children or care for them (as an alternative to unrelated foster care) then please let the social worker know as soon as possible. A family group conference (FGC) is a good way of bringing your network together so this is something you can ask the social worker to arrange if you think that it might help.
I am sorry to hear that you have ME. Parents are not usually asked to agree to their children going into foster care because a parent has a particular disability. As an adult with a disability, you may be entitled to some help for yourself from Adult Social Care so do look into this. However, if the parent’s health needs negatively affect their ability to care for the children safely and meet their needs then this could prompt children’s services to seek agreement to foster care. An FGC might also help identify what help your network can provide you to help you as a parent with a disability.
If you need some emotional support or practical advice, then the charities MATCH and Family Line may interest you.
If you would like to discuss your situation with an adviser, please call the freephone advice line on 0808 8010366, Mon to Fri, 9.30 am to 3.00 pm (except bank holidays. If you prefer you can post again with any further queries or send an advice enquiry form or use our webchat.
I hope that the children’s LAC review goes well, that you are clearer about your options and know how to progress the children’s return home, if possible.
Best wishes
Suzie
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Re: 3 children in care
The iro at the meeting said nothing about me not receiving paperwork before the meeting.
The social worker still has not given me something to say what she wants me to do before they are allowed home. It has now been 5 and a half weeks and am no nearer to knowing what she wants off me. Also the placement meeting for the 2 youngest 2 children took place without me, when I asked about when it was going to happen I was told it was done weeks ago.
The social worker said she didn't invite me because she says I was to ill to do a online meeting , I was not to ill and she didn't even give me a chance. How do I get a copy of the minutes of the meeting and make sure they have not been edited
The social worker still has not given me something to say what she wants me to do before they are allowed home. It has now been 5 and a half weeks and am no nearer to knowing what she wants off me. Also the placement meeting for the 2 youngest 2 children took place without me, when I asked about when it was going to happen I was told it was done weeks ago.
The social worker said she didn't invite me because she says I was to ill to do a online meeting , I was not to ill and she didn't even give me a chance. How do I get a copy of the minutes of the meeting and make sure they have not been edited
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Suzie, FRG Adviser
- Posts: 4722
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:57 pm
Re: 3 children in care
Dear hollna22
Thank you for your further post.
I am sorry to hear that you did not receive your children’s LAC paperwork before the review meeting and that the IRO did not address this. And that the social worker has not clarified what steps they would like you to take before they would support the children’s return home to you.
As my understanding is that the children are in foster care under a section 20 voluntary arrangement then children’s services should agree and share all the children’s plans with you. You have parental responsibility for them and can end your consent – but this could result in an escalation to care proceedings, as explained previously.
You could:
• Email the social worker copying in their manager and the IRO politely stating that you have not been given a copy of the children’s care plans and requesting that the social worker provides them to you as soon as possible.
• In the email, highlight that you are disappointed that you were not invited to the children’s placement planning meeting, that you dispute the social worker’s statement that you were too ill to attend as you say that you were not too ill to go to an online meeting and were not given the opportunity.
• There are unlikely to be detailed minutes of the placement planning meeting, but the children’s plan would have been finalised there – so ask for a copy of that plan instead.
• Ask the social worker to put in writing to you what they want you to do/what needs to be different to arrange a planned return home. Ask them to inform you if they intend to begin care proceedings.
• See our guide to working with a social worker for tips on how to get the best out of this working relationship.
• If the social worker is not responsive let the IRO know as they have a role in resolving difficulties.
• If these steps don’t help, then you can consider making a complaint. Please see here for how to do so.
I hope this is useful.
Best wishes
Suzie
Thank you for your further post.
I am sorry to hear that you did not receive your children’s LAC paperwork before the review meeting and that the IRO did not address this. And that the social worker has not clarified what steps they would like you to take before they would support the children’s return home to you.
As my understanding is that the children are in foster care under a section 20 voluntary arrangement then children’s services should agree and share all the children’s plans with you. You have parental responsibility for them and can end your consent – but this could result in an escalation to care proceedings, as explained previously.
You could:
• Email the social worker copying in their manager and the IRO politely stating that you have not been given a copy of the children’s care plans and requesting that the social worker provides them to you as soon as possible.
• In the email, highlight that you are disappointed that you were not invited to the children’s placement planning meeting, that you dispute the social worker’s statement that you were too ill to attend as you say that you were not too ill to go to an online meeting and were not given the opportunity.
• There are unlikely to be detailed minutes of the placement planning meeting, but the children’s plan would have been finalised there – so ask for a copy of that plan instead.
• Ask the social worker to put in writing to you what they want you to do/what needs to be different to arrange a planned return home. Ask them to inform you if they intend to begin care proceedings.
• See our guide to working with a social worker for tips on how to get the best out of this working relationship.
• If the social worker is not responsive let the IRO know as they have a role in resolving difficulties.
• If these steps don’t help, then you can consider making a complaint. Please see here for how to do so.
I hope this is useful.
Best wishes
Suzie
Do you have 3 minutes to complete our evaluation form ? We would value your feedback on the parents’ forum.
Re: 3 children in care
I have another care meeting on Tuesday , I have only just received a child and family assesment but still have not got the original care plan that I should have received before the first review meeting on the 8 th may. The family and child assesment is full of lies about me and things that my oldest child has said that are totally not true, for instance he says that as soon as he was 16 I was throwing him out and he states that I called him a freek and a paedofile which I have never and never would call him that. He says this happened in February but I didn't even find out untill April that he had told the social worker that he is trans and I am totally fine with it. There are at least 40 lies in the assesment and I don't know what to do the next care meeting is on Tuesday they took all 3 on the 15 th and 16th of April and I don't know who has copy of these lies. Also is the care plan meeting when I find out what plans for mychildren they have.
Re: 3 children in care
It also states that my oldest when he was 9 was carrying his baby sister up and down the stairs when we lived in a bungalow with no upstairs.
Also staying I drank full bottles of wine when I hardly ever drink
Also staying I drank full bottles of wine when I hardly ever drink
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Suzie, FRG Adviser
- Posts: 4722
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:57 pm
Re: 3 children in care
Dear Hollna22,
Thank you for your further posts.
You say that there are allegations about you in the child and family assessment which you do not believe to be true. You are not sure what to do about this.
I would suggest that you make it clear in the next meeting (which I think is today) that you do not accept the allegations made against you. If you wish to you can also put this in writing by emailing the social worker and their manager (and cc’ing in the independent reviewing officer). You should keep your email concise and factual.
It is also important that you understand that if your oldest child did make these allegations against you then the social worker must take these into consideration and must include these in the assessment. If your child is making up untrue things about you then it is important for the social worker to work with them to understand why they are doing this. Similarly they must also work with your children to try and understand if these allegations have any truth in them.
At the meeting today, which is called a looked after child review meeting, you should be given a copy of the care plan and this should be discussed in more detail. This will include the local authority’s suggestion of where your children should live, what contact they should have with you (and any other family members or friends), what support the children might need for their education, and any health needs that they might have. You can find out more information about care plans HERE.
I hope that this is helpful,
Best wishes,
Suzie
Thank you for your further posts.
You say that there are allegations about you in the child and family assessment which you do not believe to be true. You are not sure what to do about this.
I would suggest that you make it clear in the next meeting (which I think is today) that you do not accept the allegations made against you. If you wish to you can also put this in writing by emailing the social worker and their manager (and cc’ing in the independent reviewing officer). You should keep your email concise and factual.
It is also important that you understand that if your oldest child did make these allegations against you then the social worker must take these into consideration and must include these in the assessment. If your child is making up untrue things about you then it is important for the social worker to work with them to understand why they are doing this. Similarly they must also work with your children to try and understand if these allegations have any truth in them.
At the meeting today, which is called a looked after child review meeting, you should be given a copy of the care plan and this should be discussed in more detail. This will include the local authority’s suggestion of where your children should live, what contact they should have with you (and any other family members or friends), what support the children might need for their education, and any health needs that they might have. You can find out more information about care plans HERE.
I hope that this is helpful,
Best wishes,
Suzie
Do you have 3 minutes to complete our evaluation form ? We would value your feedback on the parents’ forum.
Re: 3 children in care
The social worker wasn't interested in the pages of lies that are continuously mentioned all through the 31 page child and parent assesment. I am due to have a second review meeting today but I was told I only have 6 months before it goes to court .
It has already been 3 months and don't think anything is going tobe done during the 6 weeks school summer Hollidays which starts next week as teachers won't be in work. My oldest which was 15 when they took him turned 16 2 weeks later. He won't talk to me and won't even let me write to him , I have not had any contact with him since they took him. He has since left school and told his doctor he wants to beat girl and wants to be called she and her and wants to be called by a new name that she has chosen. I want to be able to support her . I feel like the son they took is dead but I am not allowed to have contact
With this new daughter
At the review meetings I don't know what to say to get her to see me and still don't know what is expected of me to get the younger children back home. I wasn't told that 2 weeks after they took my oldest that once he was 16 he never needs to come home ever again. I can't cope much longer and since they took them my health has gone down hill because of all the stress and trauma they have put me through
I am worried that my health is going to go against me as they said it was my health was why they took them in the first place,but since all this has happened it has gone worse. Has anyone got anyadvice
It has already been 3 months and don't think anything is going tobe done during the 6 weeks school summer Hollidays which starts next week as teachers won't be in work. My oldest which was 15 when they took him turned 16 2 weeks later. He won't talk to me and won't even let me write to him , I have not had any contact with him since they took him. He has since left school and told his doctor he wants to beat girl and wants to be called she and her and wants to be called by a new name that she has chosen. I want to be able to support her . I feel like the son they took is dead but I am not allowed to have contact
With this new daughter
At the review meetings I don't know what to say to get her to see me and still don't know what is expected of me to get the younger children back home. I wasn't told that 2 weeks after they took my oldest that once he was 16 he never needs to come home ever again. I can't cope much longer and since they took them my health has gone down hill because of all the stress and trauma they have put me through
I am worried that my health is going to go against me as they said it was my health was why they took them in the first place,but since all this has happened it has gone worse. Has anyone got anyadvice
Re: 3 children in care
I had the review meeting today , at the first meeting. I was told after 6 months it would go to court to take them permanently
At the end of today's meeting they made another review meeting but not while January of next year. I am confused to know wether it will be taken to court before next January as there was no mention of courts today . I did ask wether when they go back to school in September wether they know if it will be weeks or months before they will be home. All they did say was they will be coming home . The social worker just keeps saying she can't set a set date for them coming home which is not what I asked for . I asked wether it would be weeks or months once the youngest 2 children were back in school after the summer Hollidays
My middle child keeps coming up with the idea that after set events he will be coming home but they won't even give us a clue to if it is going to be before or after Christmas as I was told the review meeting in January might only be for the oldest one.
I am not being given a clue as to wether to expect the youngest two home for christmas
At the end of today's meeting they made another review meeting but not while January of next year. I am confused to know wether it will be taken to court before next January as there was no mention of courts today . I did ask wether when they go back to school in September wether they know if it will be weeks or months before they will be home. All they did say was they will be coming home . The social worker just keeps saying she can't set a set date for them coming home which is not what I asked for . I asked wether it would be weeks or months once the youngest 2 children were back in school after the summer Hollidays
My middle child keeps coming up with the idea that after set events he will be coming home but they won't even give us a clue to if it is going to be before or after Christmas as I was told the review meeting in January might only be for the oldest one.
I am not being given a clue as to wether to expect the youngest two home for christmas
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Suzie, FRG Adviser
- Posts: 4722
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:57 pm
Re: 3 children in care
Dear hollna22
Thank you for your posts. I will be responding to them both here.
I am sorry to hear of your continued confusion about the care process. It must be frustrating for you. As previously advised, I suggest you put your views in writing to the social worker and include their manager and the independent reviewing officer.
From the information you have shared it does not appear children’s services are in a rush to take the matter to court. It may be that the situation remains the same for now – ie. the children are looked after under a Section 20 agreement and the situation is monitored. However, I can’t say for certain and I think children’s services need to clarify the situation for you and the children now.
It is not helpful when you hear conflicting information, especially in times of high stress. This also applies to the children. If they are confused or uncertain this will have an impact on their emotional wellbeing and it is for the adults around them to offer the ‘scaffolding’ of emotional support at this difficult time.
Please do take a look through the links we have already sent to you around Section 20 and care proceedings. They will give you a step-by-step guide to law and legislation around each and advise how children’s services should be working with you.
I think it would be a good idea for your children to have access to an advocate. Child advocacy is all about speaking up for, or on behalf of, children and young people. An advocate helps children to take part in decisions that affect their lives and supports them to voice their opinions in environments they might find challenging. A large part of advocacy work is making sure the child or young person's rights are respected, and that their wishes are heard. Advocates are non-judgemental and focus solely on the opinions of the child or young person. It would be a good idea to raise this with the social worker and IRO. I have further added a link HERE to the National Youth Advocacy Service (NYAS). Please do check out their website for further information and guidance.
You may also benefit from an advocate to support you in meetings. I have added a link
HERE to Pohwer. They are a national advocacy provider. They do not operate in all areas and do have criteria to meet however, I think it would be good idea to check out their website for further information.
You say you are being unfairly penalised due to your disability. I have added a link
HERE
you may find helpful. It is to Disability Rights. They have a section on their website which provides information and links to advocacy for people who have disabilities.
I hope this helps.
Best wishes, Suzie
Thank you for your posts. I will be responding to them both here.
I am sorry to hear of your continued confusion about the care process. It must be frustrating for you. As previously advised, I suggest you put your views in writing to the social worker and include their manager and the independent reviewing officer.
From the information you have shared it does not appear children’s services are in a rush to take the matter to court. It may be that the situation remains the same for now – ie. the children are looked after under a Section 20 agreement and the situation is monitored. However, I can’t say for certain and I think children’s services need to clarify the situation for you and the children now.
It is not helpful when you hear conflicting information, especially in times of high stress. This also applies to the children. If they are confused or uncertain this will have an impact on their emotional wellbeing and it is for the adults around them to offer the ‘scaffolding’ of emotional support at this difficult time.
Please do take a look through the links we have already sent to you around Section 20 and care proceedings. They will give you a step-by-step guide to law and legislation around each and advise how children’s services should be working with you.
I think it would be a good idea for your children to have access to an advocate. Child advocacy is all about speaking up for, or on behalf of, children and young people. An advocate helps children to take part in decisions that affect their lives and supports them to voice their opinions in environments they might find challenging. A large part of advocacy work is making sure the child or young person's rights are respected, and that their wishes are heard. Advocates are non-judgemental and focus solely on the opinions of the child or young person. It would be a good idea to raise this with the social worker and IRO. I have further added a link HERE to the National Youth Advocacy Service (NYAS). Please do check out their website for further information and guidance.
You may also benefit from an advocate to support you in meetings. I have added a link
HERE to Pohwer. They are a national advocacy provider. They do not operate in all areas and do have criteria to meet however, I think it would be good idea to check out their website for further information.
You say you are being unfairly penalised due to your disability. I have added a link
HERE
you may find helpful. It is to Disability Rights. They have a section on their website which provides information and links to advocacy for people who have disabilities.
I hope this helps.
Best wishes, Suzie
Do you have 3 minutes to complete our evaluation form ? We would value your feedback on the parents’ forum.
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